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Friday, November 27, 2009

Art and Globalization

Modern artists had always positioned themselves as honest persons, indeed the single artist present itself as the only honest person in a world of hypocrisy and corruption. It is important to investigate how the production of trust and sincerity has functioned in modern times in order to elucidate the way it functions today.

The current idea of “global art” is set along the lines of Coca-Cola and McDonald’s—the McDonaldization of the world. Given the experiences of the past, the West knows that, on one hand, these words are only to give them comfort, and, on the other hand, it is certain that the artists of many countries do not have sufficient knowledge and the means of entry to their domain. If with great difficulty, one or two of them do arrive with a pat or two on the back, they can be absorbed within their [Western] culture.

Besides under certain circumstances, blending cultures might be beneficial, but its disadvantages are obvious. The blending of cultures can only occur between two or a few cultures which are similar, presented to the world in a compatible and harmonious manner. A commanding, dominant culture does not blend well with a dependent, imitating culture. Rather, the former devours the latter.

History has demonstrated that whenever two or a few cultures have faced each other, be it in a peaceful, coexisting manner, or in a conflicting manner, new experiences occur; we call them “multi-cultural” experiences. Today, cultures are expected to resist being devoured by dominating cultures by focusing on their own special features. The efforts of the West are aimed at presenting the art of other peoples as the “symbol of collective identities” while ignoring the individual identities of “others,” that same individuality upon which Western art established itself and through which it attained an identity.

Nowadays art is becoming like any other commodity or product exported and imported worldwide. Small artists can take advantage of a larger platform to sell their works and if they succeed they they have the possibility to reach anyone, anywhere in the world.

Does the evolution of a new hybrid language and the globalization of English provide insights into trends in contemporary art? Will local creativity and regional distinctions be lost in the rush to a common global culture? Or will cultural hybridization and international cultural exchange add strength and help to increase creative expansion?

76 comments:

~otto~ said...

I lived on the US-Mexico border for a few years and got a good taste of cultural blending. It was delicious. But Mexico was tasty by itself, too.

Jason Gusmann said...

first off, mariana, i love yr new tagline (the past is not dead, it's not even past) cuz it is absolutely true! secondly, the issue of globalization and art speaks to me directly. most of the people who read my blog-work are from outside the US, and ive often asked if thats an issue of availability or interest. as the US as both a cultural and economic power is on a serious decline, i believe this particular western power will be far more open and inviting towards art from elsewhere.

/t. said...

art
will resist
all generalizations

international net.art ('internet art', c.1995-) has resulted in
both creative expansion/new thinking and a certain homogenization of creativity/thinking, or, on the latter, perhaps accelerated what is already happened/happening inside the academy... forever

well, my opinions

× × ×

/t.

girlontape said...

"the production of sincerity and trust" i love it! thinking 'bout the ancient roman empire... how it absorbed, but also in some cases preserved... in spite of its own dominant fascistic worldview. time & art historians will tell.

Andy Coffey said...

Ah, Mariana,

These are great questions for a wonderful discussion. My God you have a fine mind.

Many artists may regard themselves as uniquely sincere, and their work as more relevant to "reality" than the more pedestrian things a person might do for work or career. But even a cursory glance at the ghetto of artists many of us are lucky to know in our own cultures, reflects something rather different from a sincerity (in their displays) and more and more what you are describing here: a capitalistic marketing of creative endeavors, meant from the beginning, as an unavoidable means to an end rooted in lucre, as much as, if not more than, self expression. Something tells me that my friends seeking graduate degrees in Art School here in Bloomington, are not being challenged by their professors to turn their backs on a career in art. For, in the West, and the Westernized world, their is no "uncommodified" market or street. There is nowhere to mix ideas, in the explosive cafe. Just Starbucks after Starbucks and gallery after gallery with killer Apps on the wall and floor. This is Art?

Many Artists I know have simply given up hope.

The West has placed the saturation of your pleasure centers above every other virtue imaginable. In the face of such religion, Art is a long sentence indeed. Unless it pays.

Regional distinctions and local creativity are being lost in the form of languages all over the world. What most of us don't much realize is that the quality of our lives is often considerably poorer than even some ancient cultures enjoyed. And yet we have the instruments, and paradigms to measure our weakness better than ever. What do you think the conversation becomes? Preservation of valuable (but unsalable) culture?

You can stop progress: but like a fiber optic cable, it costs per minute more than what most of our lives are valued at.

For Christ sake, thanks for blowing my mind.

ArtSparker said...

I suspect that you are looking forward to a controversy here, as well you might. One important aspect you are leaving out, I think, is the artists of non-Western cultures who gain enough familiarity and fluency when introduced into it (and it's everywhere) to critique it from an outsider's standpoint. Artists are (okay, there's an ego inverstment here) not always good at being absorbed.

Rick said...

Hello, Mariana. This is an incredibly interesting post to read. Especially since the East has been involved in exactly the same endeavors as the West in these regards, although they began much earlier! I used to have some rather extensive notes on the transition of the Samuari families into the world of business, and what was interesting to me was their awareness of the global market for art with multi-cultural potential. All "collective identity arts" were considered as still-developing arts which were considered pallid reflections of Japanese art. I could list a few other cultures, but I believe the phenomena you are discussing is very much independent of the East-West divide. India is perhaps the most interesting case study in this regard, however.

I think that there is not much danger of a global culture stamping out local identities, though. Artists and writers are by nature dissenters and agents of rebellion. We come together to split apart to come together and so forth. It is, I think, our nature.

Love these postings, Mariana, you are a wonderful example of how an intelligent and thoughtful person can provide a positive platform for interesting discussion.

otin said...

The only reason that lesser cultures are devoured by larger cultures is because the lesser cultures have a desire for what the larger cultures have. Coke and McDonalds are something that the world wants. Smaller cultures would not be over run by the larger ones if they did not invite the invasion!

Paul said...

That's a very interesting question. I think there is a constant flux between homogenisation and individuation, a kind of cycle. Certainly wouldn't want a complete globalisation of culture, but seeking out similarities and confluences can be just as productive as highlighting differences.

Maxine said...

An interesting post, and very topical here in Australia. An Aboriginal artist here recently had her work reproduced on a limited edition Hermes scarf that retails around $500: a fee that most people she knows could never afford. I'm not sure whether to be elated or sorrowful about this.

paulandrewrussell said...

I think the globalization of any language is good if it gets us all talking to each other Mariana.

I think some cultural identity may well be lost but more will be gained in understanding of other people. And if we exchange ideas, artistically and culturally, then we'll all be the better for that.

geek said...

Very interesting points here, Mariana. The thought of globalization can indeed be overwhelming. However, I do not think that "regional distinctions and local creativity" will ever be lost. In one way or another, a community still retains its identity even with the increasing globalization. No matter how much of the Western culture is diffused in a community, that community can and does transform that "Western" culture to be its own. The term "glocalization" comes to mind. For example, McDonalds is very popular here in the Philippines. However, if McDonalds retain its "Western-ness", it wouldn't thrive in my country. Thus, it has to incorporate the Filipino culture -- in this case, in the food choices. Thus, McDonals opted to serve rice meals, which is not available in the US.

Same thing can be said about arts, I guess. Abstract, Impressionism, etc, etc, are all Western types of visual arts. However, they are borrowed by many cultures and are appropriated to these specific cultures.

Another example is in music. Hiphop is created in the West, but it has been popular in Japan. Because hiphop in Japan had its own roots, it has been appropriated to Japanese culture. So, although hiphop is a product of globalization, one cannot say that American hiphop is the same with Japanese hiphop because they are totally different from each other -- the traditions when making rhymes, subjects for songs, etc. In a way, Japan has "indigenized" hiphop into its own culture.

Mark Kerstetter said...

Mariana, can you please explain what you mean by your first sentence, or at least lend some support for this notion?

Jon said...

something of what you say here has lead to the rise of what is called the "uncreative artist"...

the artist who works in pastiche and denies that creative ability is a 'gift' as such, but is something that anyone can do...

check out one of my friends manifesto on plunderverse, a kind of uncreative writing:

http://wordsters.net/poetics/poetics05/05betts.html

Ted Bagley said...

It seems to me that the same questions were most likely asked by some in Medieval Japan in regards to all things regarding Chinese.

girlontape said...

marian check out artist ivan gaete on my friend's site... he works with scientific concepts... might interest you, besotes stef

J said...

"Coke and McDonalds are something that the world wants. Smaller cultures would not be over run by the larger ones if they did not invite the invasion!"

No, I think it has more to do with the creation of desire and exploitation of weakness by a more cunning culture.

Mariana Soffer said...

Ted Bagley: you have a great point there, which is worth exploring (I belive that history repeats itself most of the time),is just that nowadays we have a different scenario which includes internet and the possibility of having inmediate access to everything everywhere.
Thanks a lot for your great point

Mariana Soffer said...

Mark Kerstetter:
First It refers to the ideal people have about a real artist, such as a pure and uncorrupted searcher of his work.
Then it wants to make you think about how that ideal of what an artist was evolved with time, and how it works.

Please feel free to ask any other thing you want, I will be more than happy to try help
Take care pal

Mariana Soffer said...

Jon:
Very interesting text the one from your friend. Specially what you denied the artist classical idea of creativity. and view this issue in the text from a completelly refreshing viewpoint. Somehow it reminded me of duchamp, its mingitory and how do you relate creativity with that artwork.

Mariana Soffer said...

geek:
Gteat comments, thanks a lot for taking your time in doing a deep reflection about my text. The first paragraph is a great and really clear description about how two cultures can and tend to influence each other. I think your example is accurance in a high percentace of cases, more than 80, but there are also many other kinds of cultural influences and relations.
I am not sure why you say that they are all western types of visual arts, for example impressionism had a strong component of eastern aesthetics/philosophy/influence. But it is true that they can be borrowed or appropiated.

Great example the one about hip hop, I did not knew it, and found it fascinating how they adopt and adapt the artitic styles. Thanks for this great info.

Love and take care
M

Mariana Soffer said...

Paul:
Thanks for your interesting reflection, I think that you can
consider homogeneisation and individuation as the two sides of the same coin. Which implies a lot
Thanks a lot for stepping by
M

Mariana Soffer said...

paulandrewrussell :
Regarding what you say about language globalization I think- it is also positive that English has become a universal language. For instance, here on Blogger we can speak to people from all over the world without worrying about language barriers. That is amazing in many ways.
But the ideal would be a a fellow bloger said:I am hoping that two things happen at the same time. That we develop a universal language, naturally and organically, that retains the best bits of all the world's languages and that the great rich diversity of separate languages (including indigenous languages)is retained and respected. I hope we can achieve both.

Mariana Soffer said...

Maxine:
Thanks for finding the post interesting.
it is a great example the one you tel about the aboriginal artist, I think you can not judge it as either good or bad, it has good aspects and bad ones, as everything, for example it is great that people can access her work, it is bad (I think) that her work will probabbly loose its original mystic and meaning. I do not know the final answer you have to weight the pros and the cons.

Mariana Soffer said...

Otin: you are completelly right, I think that maybe publicity or marketing might be involved in this, I think powerfull countries invest in them in order to make poor third world countries people belive they would improve their life be eating at mcdonalds or things like that.
As they say, there is always the pig and the one that feeds it.

Mariana Soffer said...

Rick:
I am really flattered by your compliment. I would like to know more about how this collective identity arts where considered still-developing ones (which reading do you suggest for an intro). I also agree that it goes way beyond east and west divide, and it happens at different scales also, whether regional, continental, between families, etcc.. India is an extremelly interesting case, I read some about it, and I think that trough examples of their culture it is the best way to understand this phenomenom.

I understand what you say about artist and rebelions, but I am still afraid that the other, the uniformation, might win and erase individualities and particularities.

Thanks you very much, and I apreciate your great colaborations that help this platform grow.
M

Mariana Soffer said...

ArtSparker:
Great point about eastern artist, not functioning like western one regarding cultural absorption, I think you are right, they do function differently, you can not throw them all in the same bag as if they where the same.
Deeper thoughts about how eastern artists will react needs to be produced.

Jon said...

What you say about Duchamp goes along with this same idea, but maybe Duchamp was more interested in the viewer of the artwork as the "meaning making" and thus the creative element in the artist-work-audience relationship...

the think about the uncreative artist is that maybe this is just more to the point than thinking that it's all some kind of individual spark... some would say (like my friend the plunderverser) that to be "creative" requires that the artist makes a frame or a form for the artwork -- has to put it in a kind of box... and that this is what makes art, well art...

so I guess that it follows then that "true creativity" cannot be encapsulated and put in a form... know what I mean?

thanks for your thought back above... nice to have you back!

Mariana Soffer said...

Andy Coffey:
Thanks a lot andy!
Well hughe point you have in your first paragraph, I thought about it tons of times, and I just can tell that it is not
that easy to mark the difference or even to recognize them.
For example you can check these posts I wrote about it:http://singyourownlullaby.blogspot.com/2009/01/art-ii.html

Also bear in mind that we are living in an era of instant satisfaction needed and where the real way to measure success and usually it gets confused with talent is money.

I talk a little bit in the previous comments about preservation, and so on, it is still an open point for me but My feeling is toward the preservation of the individual cultures.

Thanks a lot to you for making me think and opening my mind wider.

Mariana Soffer said...

girlontape:
exactelly I had the roman empire in my mind most of the time I was writting this post. I guess time already told (I am not sure historians ageed among themselves yet). But we need to understand it and look at it in more detail.
Thanks stef

Mariana Soffer said...

/t
Thanks for stepping by, love to see you here.
I agree that things had accelerated, but not necesarilly changed due to globalization. What I would like to explore more is which for will this surviving art take, and according to what will it be shaped.
Cheers!

Mariana Soffer said...

Jason Gusmann:
I am so happy you liked the quote, means a lot to me.
You might be right about us being more open and inviting due to its decline, but maybe it is just a matter of time till some other empire (maybe china) takes its place.

Mariana Soffer said...

otto:
I loved what you say, you said a lot in those few words, your comment is a fine piece of art.

Mariana Soffer said...

girlontape:
I loved that blog, thanks a lot
I liked this:
"Through drawing, nothingness translates into moments of order. I associate chaos with optimal equilibrium." - Ivan Gaete

Well in math chaos is actually where patterns, (which can be considered to be in equilibrium) can be found!

Mariana Soffer said...

J:
I think that sometimes the weeker part has no option, no choice, no responsability, like when kids are forced by adults to do things, they are not guilty of provoking that in adults, adults should take full responsability.
Very interesting t.

Mariana Soffer said...

Jon:
very interesting what you say about no possible encapsulation, I agree, I think that there are no possible clear delimitations or definitions about it, that is part of
it s magic and mystery. And if something is settled in art, the next step should be breaking that rigid aspectof it, art never stops moving and searching.
It is also a pleasure to have you back!

ines,gato@yahoo,com said...

What is considered culture, and what are its main controversies regarding what it involves

Mariana Soffer said...

Ines:
"culture refers to behavior and beliefs that are learned and shared: learned so it is not ‘instinctual’ and shared so it is not individual. Geertz describes the concept of culture as “an historically transmitted pattern of meanings embodied in symbolic forms by means of which men communicate, perpetuate, and develop their knowledge about and attitudes toward life." Within this definition, writes Holton, “[t]here is room here for Coca-Cola as much as Chopin, for practical knowledge as much as religious symbolism.” Granted, culture, when described in the ways above, does indeed envelope Coca-Cola and Chopin, McDonald’s and Michelangelo, ATM’s and Ambrose Bierce.
-However, does culture lose its meaning when described in such an all-inclusive way?
=Can descriptions of culture have any meaning if both the Big Mac and the sculpture of Bacchus are considered cultural artifacts?

raul said...

What does exactelly globalization refer to?

Mariana Soffer said...

Raul:
‘Globalization – the growing integration of economies and societies around the world – has been one of the most hotly debated topics in international economics over the past few years. Rapid growth and poverty reduction in China, India, and other countries that were poor 20 years ago, has been a positive aspect of globalization. But globalization has also generated significant international opposition over concerns that it has increased inequality and environmental degradation’ . Globalization is viewed not as the final stage of human progress, but rather an ideology ‘imposed on the world by transnational corporations and their fellows in governments and universities. These forces have elevated theories about market economics, free trade, consumer choice and economic ‘efficiency’ to the level of a religion – indeed, to the level of scientific fact, akin to the laws of physics – because it boosts their profits and expands their political control’ . The main globalization directions are promoting free trade which would lead to the liberalization of markets and their efficient functioning due to the competitive advantages, liberalization of foreign direct investments to increase the flow of capitals to the developing countries from the international financial markets (Agosin, 125), which of course finds reflection in the nature of multicultural and multination relations.
There are many different opinions on the matter of globalization. Some people view it as a favorable process that will lead to high economical development of all countries. Other people treat it with animosity and fright. They think that globalization will increase inequality between countries making some countries extremely poor and some extremely rich. The process of globalization gives us wide range of opportunities for the development of the world in a whole, but the process of development is uneven in different countries. Some countries join the global economy and integrate more quickly than other ones do. Countries that have been able to integrate into global economy display faster economical growth with decreased level of poverty, while the others are still trying to struggle against burning problems: poverty, low standard of living, corruption, environmental pollution and others.
So, what is the meaning of globalization? From the view point of politics and economics, globalization is the process of denationalization of markets, politics that leads to the raising of global economy. Globalization is a general meaning of the complex of relations between people, businesses, institutions and markets that appears in widening of production lines, technologies and financial instruments, in inevitable growth and strengthening of influence of international institutions, in global activity of international corporations, in considerably widening of size of the communicational and informational resources via Internet. (Barnet, 123)
Also the term globalization can be implied as the stable transformation of world space into one unified zone, where capital, goods and services can move without any obstruction. Hence, globalization implies formation of international political, scientific, economical and cultural space, so-called “global economy”.

Joe Bloggs said...

Art ryhmes with heart
Hearts are also sold
Soul+d ryhmes with gold
I would prefer all free3.2.b.1

girlontape said...

hi marian, re. my 1st comment, i meant future historians will tell about our present, it's hard to evaluate as it's all happening, one must try anyway, i know... besotes stef

Anonymous said...

Mariana, although I understand what you say about the blending of different cultures, I don't understand about the first part about the modern artist positioning her or himself against hypocrisy, or rather I think some do and some don't.
Do you have any particular artists in mind?

Mariana Soffer said...

Joe Bloggs
Very creative, I like it, it is sad dough, but most of the time its like that
thanks dude

Mariana Soffer said...

Stef
I got what you said now, it is so true. Why should it be so hard to understand what is right here? Is it because we are too involved in the situation that our reasoning capacity blurs? Is it because we take it for granted and do not pay attention to it? Is it because we need to know how it ends so we can construct the story starting by the end, by making logical connections with previous facts in order to create a sense of coherence?
Who knows bave
love

Mariana Soffer said...

anonymous:
my very dear friend, well to me it is a big issue, the difference between the real artists "they just art, and you and they know it" and the "wanna be ones" But most people do not see the different, nowadays experiences
seems to be enough.
I can think about Mozart as being a real one for example, and tons of other fake ones.
Is that what you where asking about?
if not please let me know
thanks a lot M

Harlequin said...

" the production of sincerity and trust " ... this line says it all for me. I plan to frame it and put it on my bulletin board in my office... I also think this line is emblematic of the rest of your post, Mariana.... who produces what for what purpose? who benefits? to what purpose? regardless of what the commodity is.... art or otherwise.
and I wonder about the emergence of hybrids and tribrids in both clash and harmony...I think these phenomena, and their threshold spaces, hold many stories

Mariana Soffer said...

Harlequin:
that is exactelly what I was referring to, the lack of autenticyt, of real feeling. And as you mention the lack of truthness leads to the lack of meaning and conntent, and we can go on with this subject for ever.
Thanks a lot harlequin, Loved your comment

Shubhajit said...

Society is based on inequality, diversity, and a thorough generalization is impossible, otherwise society will not form. However, we are still intermingle with each other because in background we are reaching the center of the circle by different radii. Lower understanding of a particular thing is called instinct and from that we gain little knowledge, it is more prevalent in animals, the higher than this is the reason. But it is testified that the more reasons create more confusion and thus, reason become unreasonable! The highest source of knowledge is of course is inspiration. The inspiration governs all society, nay, mankind more or less.

Cultural hybridization of English language is good and bad at the same time. It is bad for anything to confine into one parameter, one grammar. After all who created grammar? Who created all intricacies of a particular language? And on the second place, it is bad for growing children who are getting extreme twisted language in the form of sms, sub standard literature etc. I think base should always be strong and then we can do whatever we want to do with the language.

"The modern artist has always positioned himself or herself as the only honest person in a world of hypocrisy and corruption. "

How to counteract corruption? How to minimize hypocrisy? What law society must impose to make an order among people? One can say that human society by its own rules impose law, to impose fear of punishment that instil moral conducts among people. But in actual it is expensive, ineffective and vulnerable to counter attack. Honesty is much cheaper. But it is a false belief if I think I’m a fortunate if all are honest except me. There is no point of improvement of mass or society or even a small family if we are not growing individually. We must conduct in that manner what we expect from people to conduct with us. And this is tough indeed.

A Cuban In London said...

Excellent post that reminds me that the artist is the person who chooses a corner of the world to do his/her art and when his/her space starts running out, he/she moves more and more towards the nearest corner, away from the crowd. When there's no corner left, he/she will do his/her art on the ceiling, when that part succumbs, he/she will go up to the roof. Until one day he/she will come down and go back to his/her seat, crowd or not.

Greetings from London.

J said...

Mariana, I agree that there are artists with such depth and talent that they make the others look like fakes but I think the example of Mozart confuses things because Mozart is absolutely a global artist as well as having produced magical art. Every country has it's Mozart orchestra and it's classical musicians from Argentina to Korea, even though when he was alive I think many areas of the global map would have been blank.
I think it would also be true to say that classical music is not changed very much by contact with other cultures, or if it does hybridize then the hybrid has a small audience. I cannot think of any fusions between African music and orchestral music, for instance- though I expect it is there somewhere. Although some blending of classical and pop has been attempted, usually it is just pop played with orchestral instruments and not a true fusion.
I expect that if you google 'Death Metal Kabuki Jazz Orchestra' that someone somewhere has done that. I will try that search and I believe your point about global opportunities for minority arts will be proved right.
I am still not sure which global art you mean that is set along the lines of Coca Cola and MacD's except that the first artist that comes to mind related to those is Michael Jackson, who was involved in marketing Pepsi (I think) and who certainly seemed to go along those same commercial mass marketed lines.
Mozart and Jackson are both global names, both used to market products and both part of western culture, although Jackson's music has African roots via soul, rock and roll, blues so is not western in the same way just by way of business. (I also find Jackson to be as interesting as Coke and MacD's, ie. unconvincing and not very interesting.)
Maybe it could be said that the dominant musical culture, of the west, for those not in the social elite has been rooted from those at the bottom of the social hierarchy and taken around the world by American commercial enterprise. I think that is probably a result of America being the driver of mass communication, but now I think you are right that all cultures have access to global media and that will mean less dominance for American music and culture. Despite the British ruling immense amounts of territory English folk music is not the music of the people in the former colonies, but rock, pop and rap are everywhere and are the dominant forms for the masses in Britain, although the celtic areas still have their own identity and their music is part of the American dominant culture. So it seems that different dominant societies leave different cultural footprints. The Greeks and Romans left politics, philosophy, architecture; the British left sport and language; the Americans dominated with music, film, and business.
Sorry this comment is wandering and disjointed, it's a subject that deserves whole books isn't it?
Now I go look for Death Metal Jazz Kabuki Orchestra.

TC said...

Mariana,

First, grateful to have you back at this heroic industry of yours, whatever it is (!).

A thoughtful and provocative post as always, and especially apt for you, given your privilege of geographic perspective -- that is, matters of cultural imperialism are always more clearly viewed from a certain distance.

Your point about the "commanding, dominant culture" that does not "blend well" is a graceful and apt way of evoking the big fish/little fish figure (which of course you directly invoke with the word "devouring"). This goes to the heart of the matter you are addressing. The problems and contradictions it brings to mind would I'm sure give you material for at least a half dozen interesting sequels to this post.

BTW There is concurrently some perhaps related discussion re. dominant-cultural assumptions at "All the great ideologies..."

Mariana Soffer said...

Shubhait:
I think instinct is the more basic form of understanding, and the more complex is reached by reasoning, which is a double edge swords, because it can help us broaden our comprehension of the world
but it can also blur it. We are like animals regarding instinct, but we have on top of it a way of expanding this basic information trough the reasoning modules our brain anatomy provided us with.
The problem with reasoning is when we blindly belive in it, you have to remember that we are limited in the amount of things we can include in this process and that we can also make mistakes trough this
process, that is when reasoning becomes unreasonable. Regarding inspiration, I do not understand it very well, never thought about it deeply (well I did but nothing come out). If you feel like please provide us with a little more detail about what you mean by it.

I liked a lot your 2nd paragraph. I agree we need to start from a solid ground (which is not happening nowadays do to the facts that you mention) and as you say grow from it. So we are starting from an
unstable and unclear base, which is not solid, and use it to sustain what grows from it, which can end up being really disorted.

Completelly agree that we must start with ourself and once we are relativelly ok, think in a more global way (society), this reminds me of what buddhists say.

Excelent reflections, thank you very much for enriching so much the discussion
M

Mariana Soffer said...

A Cuban in London:
Thank you very much for your compliment, I loved your description of an artist, it is poetic an accurate. I think of them sometimes as constant seekers and challengers, which I found coherent with what you say

Take care
M

Mariana Soffer said...

J
Interesting what you say about classical music and not mixing, you are right, the only thing It came to mind is that groups such as the Beatles borrowed a lot from it, the harmonies, melodies, scales, etc..
But that is a different kind of interaction about the 2 musical cultures.
I do not refer by mentioning McDonald to the business part of art, I do refer to it as a serial production of it (hope this clarify it a little bit).
I liked what you say that different cultures are related to different areas such as american to movies, others to politics, etc .. and they are big influencers in that areas.
But I am going to stop here though I can say millions of things regarding this, but we should discuss this further ahead, It is really interesting.

Thanks for enriching the conversation
M

Mariana Soffer said...

TC:
thanks you very much, I still do not know what it is, but I accept suggestions.

You are right things are always seen better from a distance, when you are too close you tend to be too biased.

Excellent relation tom with your post about sustain you and me. You perfectly got the point.

Be well my friend
M

Dave King said...

One diet, one religion, one architecture, one medicine, one art fits all. That's the trend, like it or not.

Little Lamb said...

I'v never seen artists as being in that light before, as being honest, but you have a point.

aditya said...

Money is the worst thing, ever to be invented. It is killing everything around.


Aditya.

Mariana Soffer said...

Dave king
Sadly is kind like that. We are missing the interesting thins that individualities many times carry along. We are being
limitated only to the generalities.

Mariana Soffer said...

Little Lamb
I am glad I made you thought things from another angle, that makes me feel proud. I do not know why but I always tend to
divide artist in the ones that are honest a true to themselves and their art and the ones that are not (not that I can distinguish between them so celarly).

Mariana Soffer said...

aditya:
I do not know what to tell you, I woud not blame it exclusivelly on money, there are also the things that are arround money, such as power, fame,, etc..
I will talk about it in my next post, maybe that will clarify my thoughts.

TC said...

Mariana,

I think Aditya may be on to something here.

Good thoughts to you...

Mariana Soffer said...

TC
you are a smart guy, there is surelly something there, but don t you think greed is even more damaging+
Just a question
Take care

TC said...

Mariana,

My favourite book about money is by an Englishman named John Buchan, its title tells the story that relates the two terms money and greed: Frozen Desire.

(It's cold up North right now...)

xox T

Mariana Soffer said...

TC:
thanks a lot for the recomendation of the book, it seems really interesting, money is a subject that always interested me,
this page http://www.amazon.com/Frozen-Desire-Meaning-James-Buchan/dp/1566491800 from amazon has interesting information about the book that can be of help.
here I leave you with one of his quotes:
"Because bankers measure their self-worth in money, and pay themselves a lot of it, they think they're fine fellows and don't need to explain themselves."
love
M

geek said...

Hi Mariana, sorry if it took me a while to get back at you. I shall explain why I regard the art genres I mentioned as Western. First of all, yes, you're right that there are non-Western influences in them. However, the art genres I mentioned were pioneered and championed by Westerners. They sprung from the West. You have Van Gogh, Picasso, and others which I can't remember right now since it's been years since I took Art Studies class. Many arts in other parts of the world aren't categorized as impressionist or abstract or goth, unless the artists are schooled from the Western thought of art. Artistic expression, for some, is simply telling or conveying a story or experience -- and doesn't necessarily need to be in a category some of us had made.

A good day to you, Mariana. I hope you're doing well.

Mariana Soffer said...

Geek:
Such a pleasure to have you back, it is always a good time to hear from you.
I understood your explanation about western artists and I think it makes sense what you say, it is interesting also, left me thinking about categorization and why we put labels or classify art or any other thing.
Hope you are doing good my friend
M

human being said...

.

the cup holds the content
and it is an ever growing entity
the cup?
or
the content?

both...

cultures
and ideas
mingle perpetually
at a perceptible rate
even through wars
that tend to separate

give me a few words
from an unknown language
and i
put you on a vessel
to sail the sea of my soul

thinking defies sinking

i'm rich
not because i've got some vessels
but
because
i'm a sailor

.

human being said...

you left your precious answer under today's post... i've brought it here to have it beside my words...
thanks for your insightful answer... as always...



Mariana Soffer said...
True, also how the question is made can be completelly determinant on the answer.
I do agree with you that words are just tools, the same way internet is a tool, atomic power is a tool,
etc ... The sole idea to judge wether those things are good or bad is completelly stupid, the judgment should
consider the intention of humans in using those things and also judge them, not the inhert tools.

Thanjs a lot for your cool and interesting comment

December 10, 2009 3:01 AM

Mariana Soffer said...

human being
I like your idea of freedom, I want that in my life.

Cups and contents, like cultures and ideas are in constant movement, interacting among themselves, evolving, involving, they are a living thing. A good example to picture this is momdern internet life, everything is alive, modifying itself, influencing something else, new trends appear, some adapt, some not, ...

By the way the 3 words "thinking defies sinking are marvelous".

Mariana Soffer said...

Human being
I am glad I was able to express an interesting thought with proper words, I would like to do that, specially for you, more often, but I can not do it all the time, words just do not flow sometimes. But you inspire me.

human being said...

.

words are always there
in you
peeking through your mind

let them flow
in any form
they
like

when they are freed
you are free too

and the sky
will be bluer
than ever

.

txandi said...

instead of hybridization, yo intento mezclar. no soy la unica~t~

Mariana Soffer said...

Human being:
beautiful poem! So nice. Once again you made my day happier.
Made me think about the magical thinks we can experience, and how lucky we are for that.

Mariana Soffer said...

txandi:
Pretty cool what you propose, it mixing is a different kind of relation than hybridization, there are different rules. It would be nice if you can describe those differences in more detail, I would like that.

By the way interesting blog, I am going to take a look at it for sure.